Practical Mysticism

[sferrari17]

Technically, this post belongs here in the Christianity section. However, I think the discussion will be of interest to others, and in particular, Buddhists.

What do you guys think of mysticism?  I am just getting into it through the book Practical Mysticism by Evelyn Underhill (download it here for free: http://www.gutenberg.org/etext/21774).  I'm not very far in yet (it's kinda slow reading), but the concept is very intriguing.

The book defines mysticism in this manner:

"Mysticism is the art of union with Reality.
The mystic is a person who has attained that union in greater or less degree;
or who aims at and believes in such attainment."

My dad says that in practice, the mystic tries to let go of their thoughts through meditation in order to 'hear' the voice of God.  It's pretty difficult to do (try sitting still for 30 minutes without thinking anything), but I'm working on it, and I find meditation very relaxing.  I'm doing it at 6:00 am, so I'm finding myself a little be sleepy, but it's still been pretty rewarding after only three days. 

So, yea or nea?  Is mysticism something worth pursuing?  Let me know your thoughts.

[jacknky]

17,
Excellent question. (Of course, I would say that.)

I practice Buddhist meditation about an hour a day, more when I go on retreats. Meditation can be as rewarding as the effort we put into it. There are many forms of meditation. The type I practice has nothing to do with hearing or seeing God but rather learning to see and hear myself and my world more clearly. OTOH I had a Catholic friend who practiced meditation and she did think it brought her closer to God. So I guess we get out of it what we put into it.

We can meditate simply to relax or we can meditate to raise our awareness. We all have hopes, fear, predilections, neuroses and so on that we usually don't pay attention to. Many of us simply act and react with little awareness. Meditation helps us slow down and pay attention. Awareness is a powerful thing.

To me, there is nothing mystical about meditation. Things are what they are and simply seeing them more clearly doesn't make that awareness a mystical experience. The Zen Master who is my teacher has told me about being on year long retreats where he would live alone in the woods seeing no one, mostly meditating for a year. He said he would see demons and more saintly appearing creatures while he was undergoing these extremes of meditative practice and they were very real to him. He told me that Buddhist instruction is to not get caught up or be distracted by these seemingly mystical experiences but to recognize that they are manifestations of our own minds.

If you are serious about investigating meditation to raise your awareness I would suggest you find a Buddhist meditation center and get some instruction. BTW, Buddhist meditation should not affect your Christian faith in any way. At its essence, Buddhism is a practice not a set of beliefs so there should be no conflicts. You are free to incorprate those parts of Buddhist philosophy that make sense to you and reject the ones that don't. The Buddha would approve of that, I think, since he encouraged us to be lights unto ourselves and to test the teachings by our own experience and reasoning.

Thomas Merton, a monk at Gethsemine Abbey here in Kentucky, was a meditation practitioner writing books about the subject. I don't think he had any problems with the Church because of it.

[allthegoodnamesweretaken]

Interesting topic. 

I do an hour or more of meditation daily.  Sometimes I see things, more often, I don't.  I kind of feel that meditation is more for me.  To center myself. 

I've never tried to do so in an effort to communicate with my gods, I communicate with them enough already through dreams and visions. 

If you feel you this is something you need to do to communicate with your deity, I don't see any harm in it.

all

[sferrari17]

Really, it's not necessarily to communicate with 'my deity', as you put it.  It's more to remove the distraction of my self and my own thoughts (to get myself out of the way, so to speak) so that I can be more aware, and in the process, become more aware of what God says to me. 

I doubt there are any Buddhists within a hundred miles of me.  I live in the Bible Belt (South Carolina), so we really don't get much besides Christians, atheists, and people who are too immersed in their daily lives to care about a belief system.  However, I wouldn't be averse to checking out some Buddhist meditation.  I think that parts of Buddhism are very true and very useful, and I also think you are right in that you can practice many of principles of Buddhism without neglecting Christianity.  However, for now, I'll probably try to work my way through this book.  Thanks for the tips.

[jacknky]

17,
You might be surprised to find a Buddhist retreat or meditation center nearer than you think. The Zen Center I go to is stuck up in the middle of the Kentucky hills in the middle of nowhere. A Google search might be revealing.

As for books, many of us think "Mindfulness in Plain English" is the best primer for a beginner. It just so happens the entire book is on the internet as this address:

http://www.realization.org/page/namedoc0/mipe/mipe_0.htm

Good luck.

[sferrari17]

'preciate it.

[peterwf]

My thoughts on meditation are along the lines that we try to de-clutter, to remove the daily concerns.
But, rather than emptying and listening for a spoken voice we look for any form of communication,  apparent train of logic in the randomness of life.

If we take the prophet Elisha:

"2 Kings 3:15  But now bring me a minstrel. And it came to pass, when the minstrel played, that the hand of the LORD came upon him."

We do not know if the minstrel sang or had an instrument or even if it were a decernable tune, it may have been a two chord sequence as played today in charismatic churches to accompany the singing in tongues, similar to Pink Floyd's "A Saucer Full of Secrets."

But there was not silence and isolation.

If one is trying to communicate with a big living god then one can expect him to be able to break through at least some of the noise, and use the noise of daily life to communicate. At least we must not try to limit the diety's method of reaching out to us.

A quote from the book mentioned in OP:
"Even those objects which minister to our sense-life may well be used to nourish our spirits too."

[sferrari17]

I see God in all kinds of ways in my daily life, and I don't doubt that he works through our ordinary routines.  However, there is something special about getting rid of all the distractions, getting our own selves out of the way, and simply tuning in to what God has to say.  I understand what you are saying about connecting to God through music, speaking, and other things.  I've experienced that often at church retreats with incredible worship and sermons.  However, some of that feeling is mere fellowship and emotion, and you can get an emotional high like that from other things as well.  Sometimes getting rid of the commotion can be beneficial.

[Lilly]

The book defines mysticism in this manner:

"Mysticism is the art of union with Reality.
The mystic is a person who has attained that union in greater or less degree;
or who aims at and believes in such attainment."

The "Reality" in this definition is one way of saying God.  The mystic is trying to attain union with God through meditation and an attempt to reach a higher consciousness.  Here are some more definitions:

# The search through various prayers and practices to achieve unity with God in life (theosis).

# direct communion with the divine through behavioral practice

# The belief that one can achieve direct consciousness of God or truth through meditation and intuition. In mystic practices, one attempts to merge with God or the source of creation.

# a conscious (and usually disciplined) quest for direct experience of union with the divine.

# The belief that knowledge of divine truth or the soul's union with the divine is attainable by spiritual insight or ecstatic contemplation without the medium of the senses or reason

# The doctrine that the nature of reality can be known by direct apprehension, by faculties above the senses, by intuition. ...

# Mysticism is the pursuit of achieving communion or identity with, or conscious awareness of, ultimate reality, the divine, spiritual truth, or God through direct experience, intuition, or insight; and the belief that such experience is one's destiny, purpose, or an important source of knowledge

# The process of seeking union with God. A mystic is one who seeks union with God through means of meditation, contemplation, and surrender. Mysticism is a devotional, respectful, profound practice;

# A belief in the existence of realities beyond perceptual or intellectual apprehension that are central to being and directly accessible by subjective experience.

# A belief that the emotional and individual experience with God is more important than external religious behavior. ...

# Sometimes called the interior life, mysticism is a way that reaches for immediate (meaning no mediator or other mediating influence) awareness of God, and beyond that, for identity in God (in the words of Catherine of Siena, "My me is God"). ...

# Any method of developing Inner mastery and realizing one’s unity with All.

# A belief that beyond the visible material world there is a spiritual reality which may be called God that people may experience through meditation, revelation, intuition, or other states that takes the individual beyond a normal consciousness.

The idea that at times a Christian may seek quietness in order to commune with God is not mysticism.  Underlying mysticism is a belief that we are all connected to each other and the Universe.  This belief is pantheism, or panentheism.  It teaches that the unity as a whole is the Reality, or God.  When one meditates, contemplates or surrenders himself, he can rise to a higher consciousnesses to find unity with all that exists; with "God" - meaning creation itself.

Christianity, however, has a different basis of belief.  It teaches that God is the Creator of all things, but is not creation itself.  Christianity teaches that we can only find communion with God through Christ.  It teaches that we need Christ as our mediator, while mysticism rejects that idea.

My dad says that in practice, the mystic tries to let go of their thoughts through meditation in order to 'hear' the voice of God. 

True, but again their basis of belief is that God is all and they are a part of God, therefore God is within them.

Is mysticism something worth pursuing?  Let me know your thoughts.

In my view no, since I don't believe God is going to be found within my own thoughts or some higher consciousness.  I believe I have come to know God through Christ.

[Gillyflower]

You might also like to try visualizations along with the meditations.

[sferrari17]

@ Lilly

You missed the whole point.  I'm not looking inside myself for answers, but rather removing all the distractions around me (including my own thoughts) so that I can clearly seek God's will and voice.  It's different from Buddhist meditation- I use it with prayer, letting the meditation period serve as a time for when God can respond.

@ Gillyflower

What, pray tell, are visualizations?

[Lilly]

@ Lilly

You missed the whole point.  I'm not looking inside myself for answers, but rather removing all the distractions around me (including my own thoughts) so that I can clearly seek God's will and voice.  It's different from Buddhist meditation- I use it with prayer, letting the meditation period serve as a time for when God can respond.

I don't believe I did miss the point.  You asked about mysticism.  Here's what your first post asked:  "Is mysticism something worth pursuing?"  I simply pointed out that mysticism, by definition, is looking inside one's self for answers and why that's the case.

If you had asked in your first post what I think of taking time to pray and hear God's response, I would have said I think that's great.

[Gillyflower]

Some people look at meditation as a conversation with their gods.

Visualizations are (according to one source)

"Many people use guided visualization for that very purpose: to relax and refuel, since there are a variety of physical health benefits to guided visualization. These include a lowering of blood pressure as well as the level of stress hormones in the blood. After quieting body and mind, these individuals feel full of energy and exceedingly relaxed. Refreshed, they are ready to face the challenges that await them.

Others use repeated visualizations to achieve personal or professional goals. By visualizing every detail of his course beforehand, for example, a runner can improve his skill and increase his performance. A store manager may visualize herself becoming more self-confident in a work situation that is uncomfortable for her, growing in her assertiveness and self-esteem.

Still others are searching for a deeper awareness of themselves. They use guided visualization to find that place within themselves where they can get in touch with their intuition. Through images and sometimes feelings or thoughts that come up for them, they often find answers to questions they had been struggling to resolve within their conscious minds. A person who is uncertain about the direction of her career may, for example, turn to guided visualization as one tool to help her find her way."

http://psychcentral.com/lib/2006/guided-visualization-a-way-to-relax-reduce-stress-and-more/

[sferrari17]

I don't believe I did miss the point.  You asked about mysticism.  Here's what your first post asked:  "Is mysticism something worth pursuing?"  I simply pointed out that mysticism, by definition, is looking inside one's self for answers and why that's the case.

If you had asked in your first post what I think of taking time to pray and hear God's response, I would have said I think that's great.

Sorry, I assumed you had read the whole string of comments.  I clarified what I was saying in the some of my other posts.

[TigersEyeDowsing]

I know I'm coming into this a bit late....

I'm from Asheville, NC, and we have the Buddhist retreat center Embracing Simplicity Hermitage which is wonderful to visit. http://www.embracingsimplicityhermitage.org/  I don't know where in SC you are, but I've recently moved right to the NC/SC border and the Hermitage is less than an hour away. Not something you'd want to do every week probably but may be worth a shot for a mini-vacation or retreat...and, there may be a center like that near you. You never know! I tried the mind-blank meditation as a teen and it did nothing for me. One of my spiritual teachers says "The Universe abhors a void, and will seek to fill it." Which I've found very true. She advises the kind of meditation I use, which is to meditate on a thought, or concept, or need, and not do "lazy drifting" but focus.  But that's the just the answer to my needs, not everyones. Meditation is a very powerful tool, the most powerful in the world, and it's right at our fingertips.

[sferrari17]

Thanks for the advice! 

And, you're absolutely right.   I had a lot of trouble with the whole clearing your mind technique, but as it turns out, that's just a beginner's stage that helps with trying to control your mind from wandering.  After a while of practicing that, you move on to meditating on a particular scripture, spiritual need, or whatever else.